Top 5 all time captain list

[asmo]

Yet another "TOP" list but i'm not sure a captain list has ever been done.

1.GKG - Knows the game in and out and is able to be an important player while taking the capping role at the same time

2.Rabican - When he use to cap and take it serious he was great at putting his players in the right position and was able to adjust his team far before the other team could take advantage of any mismatch on the map

3. Hit - Great player, had one of the great eyes for the game and did a very good job at letting his team know what was going on around them o avoid bad situations

4. BTT - I know many have criticized him and especially for the no fg strat (lol) but i'm going to give him the pass on that. I saw him as a mini GKG someone who could handle units really well while captaining and at the same time keeping pretty good communication with his team.

5. Ska - NC always seems organized going into the match and from what I have seen ska does a good job redistributing units in game to cut down on the travel time to be able to act or counteract vs an enemy. I have heard him receive some criticism for not giving enough in-game directions but i'm going to give him the pass and assume nc uses a voice chat program or something.

Honorable mentions
Stormrider/Arzenic/Ramirez capping Trio, CRC (I don't think he is a top cap personally but he deserves a mention for what he did with NFDF), Hannibal bc he is Mormon as well.

PS: I left out any of the real old schools caps that were considered good at their time bc they pretty much just handed out units and actual strat and tactics seem almost non existent at the time.

[pogue]

1. Thor
2. Raz
3. Kirk
4. Hadiez
5. Limp

[par73]

Aug 31, 2012 2:53:14 GMT 2 asmo said:

PS: I left out any of the real old schools caps that were considered good at their time bc they pretty much just handed out units and actual strat and tactics seem almost non existent at the time.

Except for civil who had the guttermouth (chun li) ruiner (ken) phod (mbison) ananab tilps (fei long) quartet of death

[asmo]

They were good players for their time and I'm sure they would have adapted if they stuck around (like phod still being solid in 04) but none of those guys were good captains...I remember watching mwc finals films from 1999 and the stuff they did was just awful so I fast forwarded through 2000 finals films just to make sure they didn't improve vastly and yep I was right...still awful captaining/strats

The first decent strat started coming from the top teams in 2001 imo.

[adrenaline]

Ska captained NC to 5 tourney championships in 7 finals appearances IN A ROW from 2007 to 2011. No other captain has ever had that kind of success, for that long of a period... well, perhaps Rab... not sure how many victories he has as a captain now. And you are placing him 5th... below BTT and Hit? Both with 1 tourney win each... and basing this decision on the fact that he has received some criticism long after he really cared to put the effort into captaining anymore? seriously hilarious.

[flatline]

Aug 31, 2012 2:53:14 GMT 2 asmo said:

Yet another "TOP" list but i'm not sure a captain list has ever been done.

1.GKG - Knows the game in and out and is able to be an important player while taking the capping role at the same time

2.Rabican - When he use to cap and take it serious he was great at putting his players in the right position and was able to adjust his team far before the other team could take advantage of any mismatch on the map

3. Hit - Great player, had one of the great eyes for the game and did a very good job at letting his team know what was going on around them o avoid bad situations

4. BTT - I know many have criticized him and especially for the no fg strat (lol) but i'm going to give him the pass on that. I saw him as a mini GKG someone who could handle units really well while captaining and at the same time keeping pretty good communication with his team.

5. Ska - NC always seems organized going into the match and from what I have seen ska does a good job redistributing units in game to cut down on the travel time to be able to act or counteract vs an enemy. I have heard him receive some criticism for not giving enough in-game directions but i'm going to give him the pass and assume nc uses a voice chat program or something.

Honorable mentions
Stormrider/Arzenic/Ramirez capping Trio, CRC (I don't think he is a top cap personally but he deserves a mention for what he did with NFDF), Hannibal bc he is Mormon as well.

PS: I left out any of the real old schools caps that were considered good at their time bc they pretty much just handed out units and actual strat and tactics seem almost non existent at the time.

Hmm i would find it real difficult to list top 5 of all time but could easily list some of the good/better/decent captains in mwc's and such.
As far as the best of all time I would be tempted to say Rabican as he capped for many many mwcs and other tourneys and his record was generally stellar.
As far as the best captain right now or in recent years I would be tempted to say GKG as he not only comes up with the strats himself, but also captains, gives orders and even bc's like a demon or heavyhits while captaining which is pretty tough to do in this day and age.

Hmm some notable captains. No particular order or anything.

(1) Rabican - used to be a great cap. Not afraid to do different strats (ie. operation snowball). If you take into account how many successful tournaments rabican captained his teams to then probably best ever.

(2) GKG - Well currently probably the best cap. Can do it all. A late rise to prominence in myth2 but a rise nonetheless.

(3) Ska - Personally i think a good captain although some say never gives enough orders or that it was actually shaister who was primarly responsible for making the strats and such. No idea if this is true or not. I know when i used to play vs NC in tourneys that they would always go for the pinches and such and were difficult to play vs.

(4)Ducky/Bone - I thought bone was a pretty good cap most of the time (watching films blah blah). Never afraid to think out of the box so to speak and do funky strats and trades and such that would often work. On the flip-side often his trades and strats turned out terrible.

(5) Nemesis - See ducky/bone.

(6) Stormrider - Used to always cap tcox teams and they generally did well. Although I think generally it was a 3 prong mixed squads every single game ever

(7) Hitlow - was pretty good but stopped playing a long time ago.

(8) BTT/Chohan - as captains i think were overrated. Dont remember anything special about either their capping or strats. They were successful for a while but i personally dont think it was because of either of their captaining skills.

(9) Ratking - another late starter (see gkg). I think ratking is a pretty good captain. He actually has strats and decent game awareness and actually gives orders and shit. R3 wouldnt have done nearly as well recently if he wasn't capping.

(10) Raziel - well lots of people think he was the worst captain of all time but i think he was ok. See nemesis/bone in regards to what type of stuff he would tend to do.

(11) Papasrub ~BMF~ - Hmm well i think he used to be ok and was bmfs regular captain. If i went back and watched 2k films i may think differently would have to watch them.

(12) God Cops - Capped every game last year for MOC2 (and eliminated grims team last year lool). he must have been a great captain.

Side note : Who used to actually cap and make strats for civil?

Edit
(13) THOR - Most times his strats werent too bad but when the most english he could speak was "Line map newb" or "stfu it raziel tactic" then it could be difficult when he was captaining. Still it was always hilarious to play on a team he was on.

[asmo]

WTF if you are gona put rat on there you have to put me = or 1 spot higher than him as I have never lost to him in a tournament while capping vs him. He is a solid captain though and I do have respect for him.


Also I have been at it for a longer time and placed higher than him in every tournament we have both played in : o

[flatline]

Aug 31, 2012 6:52:22 GMT 2 asmo said:

WTF if you are gona put rat on there you have to put me = or 1 spot higher than him as I have never lost to him in a tournament while capping vs him. He is a solid captain though.

(14) Asmo - Decent captain for the most part does good but not unpredictable strats and trades. Unless he's playing creep vs lucklylegs and loses 27 warriors to 1 wight and such. Now if he can just get a positive damage ratio in the next 5 years.

Oh and like i said my placement/order of captains was in no particular order at all.

[asmo]

Predictable? Here is x2 of an unpredictable strat that I made work






I do what I think is best...I have done many other unpredictable strats but I don't feel like digging through the film

[asmo]

Aug 31, 2012 6:37:03 GMT 2 adrenaline said:

Ska captained NC to 5 tourney championships in 7 finals appearances IN A ROW from 2007 to 2011. No other captain has ever had that kind of success, for that long of a period... well, perhaps Rab... not sure how many victories he has as a captain now. And you are placing him 5th... below BTT and Hit? Both with 1 tourney win each... and basing this decision on the fact that he has received some criticism long after he really cared to put the effort into captaining anymore? seriously hilarious.

I didn't base it on purely tournament success if that was the case Rabican would be #1 without a doubt. I placed Hit and BTT ahead of Ska because I think they were just as good in terms of game management and they were both better BC players who were capable of doing it while capping. Also I'm pretty sure BTT at least won two 2team tournaments and maybe a few other finals appearances.

That being said Top 5 ALL TIME is very respectable

[grim]

Stormrider and Ramirez eh?

[flatline]

Aug 31, 2012 9:53:58 GMT 2 grim said:

Stormrider and Ramirez eh?

I recall storm being not a bad cap.
Although I recall doing 3 prong mixed squads for everybody every single *cruisering* game.
Stoned ramirez as captain was always funny though.
But i remember ram capping clash fr or something and getting a shitload of brigs and when questioned about it he said something along the lines of "they are good filler" or something hilarious like that.

[myrk]

where's my best captain mention flat. fag

[flatline]

Aug 31, 2012 10:50:22 GMT 2 myrk said:

where's my best captain mention flat. fag

heh well actually i meant to mention you.

(15) Myrk - Back in 2k1 for 12" Club myrk probably capped most of our games (that mattered) and if i remember correctly I think it was myrk mb that actually made like *all* of our strats. Considering we were easily the 2nd best team in that tourney (and pretty close to being on par with np) that was quite an accomplishment. My memory sucks but I dont recall seeing myrk cap any tourney games after 2k1 but i may be incorrect. Which is a shame really since around 2k1 he was a pretty good captain.

Edit :
Oh myrk also capped and heavyhit for SaO(Squids and Otters) in NML and took what was probably an overall terrible team to a pretty respectable place probably almost singlehandedly. I may be slightly incorrect on this one too!

[giantkillergeneral]

well when I think of rating captains I like to assume that the captain is the one responsible for making strat's, giving orders, etc...the whole shebang from start to finish of the match. Otherwise being a captain is just a figurehead position that happens to be the one everyone joined. Then it is just a matter of knowing how to trade the units and distribute them at the start. someone else could technically do the rest. The vast majority of captains for tournament teams do not do everything start to finish by themselves. Ska I think is the most notable example as he has a minimal or non-existent role in making the strategies, and clearly does not give much for orders in-game so it is funny to hear adren defend him. Shai definitely has always been in charge of making the strategies, and no one really takes the reigns in giving orders in the middle of the game for that team.

Also I think you have to try to imagine the difference in the team's performance had that captain not been cap. Otherwise you are just going to rattle off every player that captained for every good team, which is kind of what flat's list looks like. And while the players are good, it probably says nothing about the actual ability of the captain. Many supposedly good captains are in reality just the fortunate posterchild leader of what is a naturally good team. Also imagine how they would do when captaining a less-talented team. So in summary, 3 qualifications:

1. How well they do everything: making strats, trading, giving orders, re-distributing units, building team morale, etc.
2. How big of an impact they actually had on their team, i.e. how well their team would have performed without them.
3. How well they would could have captained a team of lesser-skilled players (but still skilled, no captain can do anything with a bunch of newbs that don't listen).

These 3 points kind of tie in with each other pretty well. Given those 3 points, would you re-evaluate your lists at all or keep them the same?