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Post by flatline on Aug 27, 2012 11:52:26 GMT 2
Insults and shit talk are part of it. To be a reliable teammate, you have to be mentally tough. The weak are culled in multiple ways. Even good players screw up and get called out for it, with all the eloquence of a... (hmm, what's a phrase that can get me called "old") ...sailor on shore leave. If one feels compelled to defend himself when called an idiot, chances are it's true. Aye wwo you make some good points. (as does sam). Insults and shit talk are most definately part of the tourney scene of myth and the myth community in general. In fact if these things were not a part of the tourney scene in particular then it would be incredibly sterile and quite honestly boring. The forums would basically be a waste of time to ever visit. The Myth Community (and tourney scene especially) has and always has had its own dynamics, some players have been feuding for years, some are best buddies one year mortal enemies the next and the year after that best buddies again. To me it's all part of the lols. Regardless there is always shit-talk and shit for the most part it is humorous and makes for a good read. An example is that for years on and off myself and gkg have at time to time gone at it in the forums (mostly about whether 2k1 was the high point of myth tourneys or whether people are better now or then or things of similar such nature). At the end of the day this has led to some pretty funny stuff that persists for ages or even years later (Inventor of melee plz). Some or a lot or probably most of these debates and such get pretty darn heated and on the surface would probably look hostile as *cruiser*. But...truth be told I actually quite like gkg and will happily engage in these debates or even flame wars and at the end of the day harbour no ill will. Hell the myth community and its particular dynamics are what keeps me coming back (sporadically I know) year after year (even if i sometimes miss a year or two). In short the community absolutely needs the gkgs, tirris, myrks, grims and whoever else to maintain the small presecence it still has. Without the shit talk and petty rivalries and lols ensuing from such things this community would have probably died long ago. I may be wrong but to myself this is the case. As an addendum. Myself I find flaming and forum wars and such regarding things pertaining to the game or things in the game or also myther's "online personas" to all be totally fair game. I must admit though that when shit "gets real" so to speak and people start crossing an imaginary line and start going on about "real life stuff" such as stalking peoples facebook pages or blah blah blah any of that particular type of garbage then i''m really not interested and find it unnescessary and not really humourous at all. |
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Post by flatline on Aug 27, 2012 12:21:14 GMT 2
To be honest those 3 players have played quite well in general in this mini draft tourney so far with the units they have been given. Only been teaming with raven but every game ive played with him he's done pretty good i thought. Empy and somnus seem to be doing alright also  Edit: Actually last week i was immediately impressed with raven on spinach fr when he was on flag with me and first thing he did was mortar block gkg's first lock shot (i was pretty surprised). Also today on the only game we won (tam koth) he had a mortar in mid and managed to keep it alive nearly all game while also actually killing shit. Empy played pretty good last week and this week also. Somnus played sometimes awesome somtimes hilarious last week but overall pretty good. In short i think the "lesser" players that have participated in this mini tourney have so far stepped up and played rather well in general. I think you make a good point here. There are some players that just need some direction and can actually do pretty good with some support from better players. I know for myself I dont have a lot of 2 tm experience. Being on Karmas team I have learned more about 2 tm games. It is also nice for me that I dont have to Capt and then make sure my team is following the strat. I like being given a particular role and just needing to worry about that. I also think just teaming and playing with better players improves, lesser skilled players, that want to learn. If the player rosters are fairly even like Asmo's tourney is a mix of player skills on all teams I think thing balance out. That is the part that I think is important is for the teams to have even skill levels. 1 bad player on each team balances out. 2 bad players one one team is almost instant lose. We need to be as inclusive as possible to keep players playing. Most will get better the more they play, but if they are basically ran off by insults or not being included in the community they usually leave. I think however something like this is done it needs to some how accommodate any serious player good or bad. I agree with a lot of what you say Sam. Quite a few players in this mini tourney have never played in a competitive myth tourney. Others have played in competitive myth tourneys on teams that just simply get wrecked in every match and if it was me on those teams I'd find myself discouraged from even bothering to enter any more tourneys. This tourney so far has provided these players the chance to actually compete in a proper tourney setting and team with "hardened" skilled myth tourney veterans so that the end result is that they are not totally out of their depth in these matches. It's also made most the matches rather competitive (and fun). Saying that....... a couple of points. (a) It seems to me that the majority if not all of the "lesser" players that signed up for this tourney do actually have a clue how to play the game as opposed to some of the players on mnet (umm say edulus? nothing against edulus he's a funny chap). (b) The lesser players I have noticed for the most part actually READ CHAT and try to follow their captains and more experienced teammates orders. This is really important. If the lesser players were of the kind that refuse to read chat or try to follow orders then these matches could be truly terrible and not much fun at all. First example that springs to mind was watching the the hver ctf game of team asmo-gkg today. I think adren told funky to go east and i think funky wasnt sure exactly how far east adren meant him to go so didnt really go to the right place. Adren noticed this in game and told him properly where to go (and to scout also). Funky actually read chat and indeed did what he was supposed to do. He even then asked for more orders once he had done that. To me thats pretty cool. This is much more important in these games than the lesser players say losing a lock cheaply to a better player or losing a battle due to their inferior clicking skills when fighting a better bcer or whatnot. Good players lose locks cheap and lose their fights also so thats not such big a deal. This draft style tournament thing has been talked about on and off for years but never managed to get off the ground until now and so far I think its been successful. So props to asmo for getting this thing off the ground and props to the experienced players and captains for being good sports and actually participating in it. Edit : Sam you played on gru for this mwc right? How many games (not matches) did gru win in this mwc? How many games (or even matches) have you yourself been a part of a winning team in in this tourney? ps. I know the answers to these questions. Just making a small point that yep it feels good (fun) to win games or matches in a tourney setting and yep i think every "lesser" player in this tourney has won a few at least. |
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Post by samthebutcher on Aug 27, 2012 14:12:16 GMT 2
I didnt mean no shit talking at all or anything, cause yea that is part of it. I was just saying we have to be as inclusive as possible to keep people playing. If someone has been playing for a while they know how the shit talking goes and are more used to it and can handle it. If though someone is new or returning and they immediately start getting told they suck and no one will pick them for a team. They probably arent going to stick around long. Imagine going to a party that you dont know many people or havent seen them in years and right away everyone start ripping on you. You are going to probably leave. Reading the other post some people talk about not letting noobs play. If you do that having a regular game that people show up to is going to be hard. We need to encourage as many people as possible to play. I think just keeping that in mind is a good idea. Let the not as good or noobs play just try to spread them out evenly on the teams. Just being in a game with skilled players is going to over time if this idea works increase the skill level of noobs. So skill level over time will become less of an issue.
Basically I am saying "If you are too exclusive, eventual you exclude everyone."
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Post by flatline on Aug 27, 2012 15:00:57 GMT 2
I didnt mean no shit talking at all or anything, cause yea that is part of it. I was just saying we have to be as inclusive as possible to keep people playing. If someone has been playing for a while they know how the shit talking goes and are more used to it and can handle it. If though someone is new or returning and they immediately start getting told they suck and no one will pick them for a team. They probably arent going to stick around long. Imagine going to a party that you dont know many people or havent seen them in years and right away everyone start ripping on you. You are going to probably leave. Reading the other post some people talk about not letting noobs play. If you do that having a regular game that people show up to is going to be hard. We need to encourage as many people as possible to play. I think just keeping that in mind is a good idea. Let the not as good or noobs play just try to spread them out evenly on the teams. Just being in a game with skilled players is going to over time if this idea works increase the skill level of noobs. So skill level over time will become less of an issue. Basically I am saying "If you are too exclusive, eventual you exclude everyone." Basically i guess i agree with you. If the noobs as such are willing to actually read chat, listen and try to follow orders and generally try their best to win then why not. Makes me wish more players (noobs and lesser players included) signed up for this little tourney and possibly could have had a couple more teams even. |
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Post by myrk on Aug 28, 2012 3:16:27 GMT 2
I suggested having a league for people 3 balls and up and another one for people 2 balls and below, that would make everyone happy.
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Post by asmo on Aug 28, 2012 3:19:46 GMT 2
I don't have time to run something like that so i'm just going to do a myth night, but if Karma goes through with the draft league I will support it.
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