Post by samthebutcher on Oct 7, 2012 17:39:55 GMT 2
My head is about to explode. There is just way too many people here and elsewhere supporting socialism/communism (Collectivism). Collectivism fails every time it is tried. Yet some people still think it can work. Collectivism goes against human nature therefore it will never work. The main reason it doesnt work is this. If you take away the fruits of a persons labor to give to another person equally who does not produce as much or not at all. The person being taken from WILL NOT work as hard or produce as much. So there will be shortages of everything. It is such a simple concept yet so many people WILL NOT accept it. The problem with Collectivism is that is the exact concept it is based on. The idea of Collectivism is based on a failed concept. As Karl Marx said "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need" So you take from the people that produce and give to those that dont.
How about applying Collectivism to grades in school. What if instead of each person earning their grade like it works now. Grades were evenly distributed. So if one person got an A and another an F. You would take half the grade points away from the person with an A give it to the person with an F and they both get a C. It is obvious what would happen. First the person that had earned an A would say "This is BS! I'm not going to work as hard as I have been just to give half of my grade points away to someone else because they cant or wont get better grades." The person with an F would say "This is nice. I dont even have to try and I still get as good a grade as that other person that worked hard." So now what happens? The person with an A stops trying so hard since their incentive to work hard has been taken away along with their grade points. The person with an F has no incentive to try harder since they get the same grade points if they work hard or not. What then happens is the over grade point average at the school drops.
That is EXACTLY what happens in a Collectivist Society. It is why raising taxes on the producers in Society (business owners) always ends up with less money in taxes. The business owners slow down or stop producing because why produce and work hard if a lot of it is taken away. It is also why Societies that provide a lot of benefits for poor have a lot of poor people. If you make it comfortable for people to be poor and not work. They dont have much reason to get out of poverty. Basically it works like this. If you make it easy to be poor. You will have a lot of poor. If you make it hard to become wealthy. You wont have many wealthy. This is also why Collectivism always ends up with forced labor. When people realize that the harder they work the more is taken away and the less they work the more they are given. People stop working. The Government then needs to step in a force people to work just to meet the basic needs of society. That is why in the Soviet Union people had almost nothing and had to wait in line for hours to get toilet paper.
Anyway here is a story about the first time that Collectivism was tried in America. It was the Pilgrims that tried it. It was an absolute failure that nearly killed them all. When they finally adopted Capitalism the had prosperity like they never knew. That is why they had the first Thanksgiving. You will see in this story that Human Nature hasnt changed. There were people that faked injury and disability to avoid working exactly like today in America. The people that started out working hard gave up since they had to give away the product of their hard work to people that wouldnt work. Just like America today. When they adopted Capitalism and everyone was responsible for them self suddenly everybody started working hard even the people that had previously said they couldnt work. As a result there was great prosperity and generosity. Since people had more than they needed they gave more freely than when they barely had enough. Capitalism breeds generosity.
Here is a video of the story.
Here are a couple of links to the story www.myfreedompost.com/2009/11/pilgrims-failed-experiment-with.html
www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1285981/posts
Benjamin Franklin speaking of the poor. "“I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”
Thomas Jefferson on taking from one to give to another. "To take from one because it is thought that his own industry and that of his father’s has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association—the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it. "
Capitalism and the beliefs of the Founding Fathers is what America was founding on. It is what America is supposed to be. It is what made America the wealthiest most powerful nation in the world. (not so much anymore)The further we have drifted from those ideas the worse and poorer America has become.
It is because other countries didnt/havent adopted the ideas that America was founded on that they fell behind America.
How about applying Collectivism to grades in school. What if instead of each person earning their grade like it works now. Grades were evenly distributed. So if one person got an A and another an F. You would take half the grade points away from the person with an A give it to the person with an F and they both get a C. It is obvious what would happen. First the person that had earned an A would say "This is BS! I'm not going to work as hard as I have been just to give half of my grade points away to someone else because they cant or wont get better grades." The person with an F would say "This is nice. I dont even have to try and I still get as good a grade as that other person that worked hard." So now what happens? The person with an A stops trying so hard since their incentive to work hard has been taken away along with their grade points. The person with an F has no incentive to try harder since they get the same grade points if they work hard or not. What then happens is the over grade point average at the school drops.
That is EXACTLY what happens in a Collectivist Society. It is why raising taxes on the producers in Society (business owners) always ends up with less money in taxes. The business owners slow down or stop producing because why produce and work hard if a lot of it is taken away. It is also why Societies that provide a lot of benefits for poor have a lot of poor people. If you make it comfortable for people to be poor and not work. They dont have much reason to get out of poverty. Basically it works like this. If you make it easy to be poor. You will have a lot of poor. If you make it hard to become wealthy. You wont have many wealthy. This is also why Collectivism always ends up with forced labor. When people realize that the harder they work the more is taken away and the less they work the more they are given. People stop working. The Government then needs to step in a force people to work just to meet the basic needs of society. That is why in the Soviet Union people had almost nothing and had to wait in line for hours to get toilet paper.
Anyway here is a story about the first time that Collectivism was tried in America. It was the Pilgrims that tried it. It was an absolute failure that nearly killed them all. When they finally adopted Capitalism the had prosperity like they never knew. That is why they had the first Thanksgiving. You will see in this story that Human Nature hasnt changed. There were people that faked injury and disability to avoid working exactly like today in America. The people that started out working hard gave up since they had to give away the product of their hard work to people that wouldnt work. Just like America today. When they adopted Capitalism and everyone was responsible for them self suddenly everybody started working hard even the people that had previously said they couldnt work. As a result there was great prosperity and generosity. Since people had more than they needed they gave more freely than when they barely had enough. Capitalism breeds generosity.
Here is a video of the story.
Here are a couple of links to the story www.myfreedompost.com/2009/11/pilgrims-failed-experiment-with.html
www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1285981/posts
Benjamin Franklin speaking of the poor. "“I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”
Thomas Jefferson on taking from one to give to another. "To take from one because it is thought that his own industry and that of his father’s has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association—the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it. "
Capitalism and the beliefs of the Founding Fathers is what America was founding on. It is what America is supposed to be. It is what made America the wealthiest most powerful nation in the world. (not so much anymore)The further we have drifted from those ideas the worse and poorer America has become.
It is because other countries didnt/havent adopted the ideas that America was founded on that they fell behind America.
